Seat cushion

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frfly172
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Seat cushion

Post by frfly172 »

My seat cushion seems to be wearing a little thin . I e mailed Oregon aero the original supplier, bad news they can’t send a replacement. You would have to go through liberty ,which is non existent. We are trying to find a way around the process. Not sure if a local shop couldn’t do a replacement of the foam. Any ideas? Thanks Ron.
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XL2driver
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by XL2driver »

Which version of the XL-2 do you have - the standard gross weight or with the Gross Weight kit ( with 100 lbs increase in GW)?

I ask because the cushions are different for each, and an XL-2 with the GW kit requires a different cushion in order to be legal, and as you found out the cushion was certified by Oregon Aero. Who now don't make them any more due to the glue no longer being available.

There are some GW cushions out there, but the standard cushion would be easier to replace.
Let me know which version you have and we'll see what we can do.
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frfly172
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by frfly172 »

I have the GW package,Thanks
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XL2driver
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by XL2driver »

OK gotcha.
I believe I know of an owner who has two of the GW cushions, not sure if he is on this forum, PM me your phone number and I'll send you his cell number and you can call him.
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Glideslope
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by Glideslope »

This whole thing has been debated back and forth amongst aircraft owners forever. The reality is that you don't have to buy the seats from Liberty or Oregon Aero for that matter.

Since our planes are Part 23 certified, they had a specific standard they had to follow in FAR 23.853 that applied to "flame-resistance" of aircraft interiors. The foam seats that were used in the original and GW versions are slightly different from my understanding but the actual leather is the exact same and was certified to the FAR 23.853 standard. As long as you use your GW seat cushions you can have an upholstery shop do it for you.

However!!

You must use a leather that has either been treated or designed for "flame resistance". Many shops probably won't know right off hand but with a little research they can find leather that has already been treated with the appropriate chemicals or manufacture process to pass the test. If there is a specific leather you want that doesn't pass the test or you are unsure, you can always have it treated after the fact so it will meet the FAR 23.853 (a)(b)(c) and (e) standards ( (d) and (f) ) don't apply per the FAA's interpretation.

All you need is to get the leather you want to use and send off 3 (3x12 inch) samples to Skandia to run the horizontal burn test. It costs around $100 and they will give you an FAA Form 8110-3 that certifies the interior to meet airworthiness standards.

If you are interested in the details, AvWeb did a writeup on this back in the early 2000's. I have looked for anything superseding the discussion and I have not found any additional FAR additions or changes that nullifies the findings. As a Part 91 operator, we can pretty much do what we want as long as you get that 8110-3 form signed by an authorized testing facility (and you use the original seat cushions from the certification). In that article, there is a PDF letter from the FAA with their interpretation confirming this is all true.

https://www.avweb.com/features_old/inte ... -aircraft/

https://skandiainc.com/services/flammab ... ification/

The one caveat to this is this is all done on the basis of being a Part 91, non-commercial operator. So I imagine if you are using your airplane for flight instruction or any commercial purpose then all of this is a gray area. I am not using mine for commercial purposes so I am enjoying my rad seats, but would have to revisit the regs and do more research if I ever wanted to lease it to a school. Hope that helps.
frfly172
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by frfly172 »

Thanks
GimpyPilot
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by GimpyPilot »

The pilot who bought my airplane has a set of spare GW cushions, new it bags. (I had them in my spares collection, which was included in the sale.) I have no idea if he'd part with them. I'm not sure what has happened but the airplane doesn't appear to have been airborne in quite some time, and he has apparently been looking for a set of flaps. Perhaps he'll get in touch.
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XL2driver
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by XL2driver »

Thanks GimpyPilot, I was going to refer him to you and the new owner of your airplane.

What was missed in the excellent detailed above response from Glideslope (thanks for all that detail!) was the fact that (as I recall) it was the density of the foam that was a crucial part of the certification process for the GW seat cushions, as they needed to absorb a higher impact load.
So if frfly172's cushions are flattening out and he needs an entirely new cushion with the foam, then I'm not sure that just any shop can supply that legally. In which case he's better off buying a cushion from your buyer.
Anyway no time to go into it further now I'm afraid, gottta run.
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Glideslope
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by Glideslope »

Yes, I would agree with that. My response is predicated on the assumption you have a useable foam cushion that was certified for the airplane. Appreciate the clarification.
frfly172
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Re: Seat cushion

Post by frfly172 »

I’m working with Oregon aero,they may have a solution ,will keep everyone apprised.
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